Curse

Chthon · Sep 25, 2008, 02:44 AM // 02:44

Not to hijack the thread too much, can anyone suggest a slightly cheaper Nehalem setup?

Lord Sojar · Sep 25, 2008, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

Not to hijack the thread too much, can anyone suggest a slightly cheaper Nehalem setup?

Nehalem is being released and marketed towards the high end crowd. Budget isn't the word used to describe the pricing on the 1st wave of releases. Come Jan or Feb, the midrange mainstream stuff will come out as well as mobile chips. Then you can build a budget Nehalem system.

Relnor · Sep 26, 2008, 07:20 PM // 19:20

Some of the information that I've seen states that while yes, Nehalem is a high end piece of hardware, it sometimes lacks in the gaming end of things and is more geared at professionals needing high end graphics for things like graphic design and video editing. Can anyone make an informed comment on this with maybe a source or two?

Lord Sojar · Sep 27, 2008, 04:50 AM // 04:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relnor

Some of the information that I've seen states that while yes, Nehalem is a high end piece of hardware, it sometimes lacks in the gaming end of things and is more geared at professionals needing high end graphics for things like graphic design and video editing. Can anyone make an informed comment on this with maybe a source or two?

In some cases, Nehalem's architecture is built for large matrix calculations and linear systems, which helps with database and large video/audio conversion and de(compression).

However, think of Nehalem as a Penryn chip with an integrated memory controller (IMC), and the riddance of the front side bus (FSB). This will improve gaming performance in all areas. While in 8-10% of the tests, Nehalem will perform equal or slightly above Penryn, in 60%+ of those tests, Nehalem will outperform Penryn by a margin of at least 7%+. This is what designates it as a new architecture.

So yes, the improvement on Nehalem versus that of Penryn are to primarily benefit mass data processing, but that doesn't mean it will not improve performance by substantial margins in other areas. Essentially, you are looking at a jack of all trades, but with slightly more focus in matrix/linear workload. Nehalem is an amazing piece of hardware. Any thought you might have of it not meeting expectation should be thrown out the window, as Nehalem will not fail to impress.

Also, keep in mind that Nehalem is Intel's perfection of their 45nm fabrication. Their doping procedure is flawless at this point, and they have their stepping maximized on Nehalem. In addition to those facts, Nehalem features Hyper Threading, which was the best thing Intel ever developed in the Netburst era (Pentium 4).

Relnor · Sep 27, 2008, 11:05 AM // 11:05

Thanks for the info. I did also hear that the 920 overclocks easily to 4.0 GHz. Air cooled

Have you herd any similar reports?

Quaker · Sep 27, 2008, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

ESA also allows you to monitor the chassis vibration levels, ambient temperature, motherboard backplate temps, and zone temperatures. It is quite handy.

Thanks for the genuine lol! And that's all the comment I'll make.

Lord Sojar · Sep 29, 2008, 12:01 AM // 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

Thanks for the genuine lol! And that's all the comment I'll make.

Did I mention all without any overhead?

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 02, 2008, 10:54 AM // 10:54

http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...164&Ite mid=1 Another source indicating Nehalem's release date. PS. According to Microsoft 64bit operatingsystems are faster however, a friend of mine said it's only 3% or so and totally not worth it (unless you want more then 4GB memory.) and because DirectX 10 is only supported on Vista should I either get Vista Ultimate 64bit or Vista Ultimate 32bit?

zamial · Oct 20, 2008, 05:15 AM // 05:15

Making a case "chicky" may require you to think out of the normal. example: My GF is going to inherit my system and I will custom build her case. I was thinking a nice yellow and then cut a flower shaped window in the side make it glow green.

My I7 build will be very outside the box (lol). I will be ordering my case and water cooling parts as time and budget allows. Yes, I will be water cooling the cpu, chip sets and anything else i can get a block for. It is going to look like it was torn out of a spaceship and very blue glowy. I will be making a build log and taking pics as this is done. I will post it here and in a few other spots.

I will suggest building a vista 64 bit system.

Evil Genius · Oct 20, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Get Vista x64 (64 bit). Home premium is the better value but if you the kind of person who needs the best then get Ultimate. (I am running Vista Ultimate x64).

Hope to see everyone post some pics/worklogs of their future Core i7 systems since some sound particularly interesting.

By the way zamial: this yellow painted case is very nice in my opinion.

zamial · Oct 21, 2008, 05:04 AM // 05:04

It seems that there are going to be some draw backs with an I7 build.

1 - The ram (ddr3) can not go over 1.65 volts at max or good bye to your cpu. soz to those that paid up for "future proofing" early on an "extreme" 775 build.

2 - There are going to be 2 chip sockets for the I7, the "extreme" and the mid range. The extreme sounds particularly dangerous as the form factor for better chips at later release date appears to focus around the mid range socket style, from what I gather.

So, either way you choose to build it, it is not going to be cheap or easy. I have been looking for new info leaks daily and google I7 motherboards. Just because it is on the internetz doesn't mean it is guaranteed true, we all know that! but the above 2 items appear in multiple places. I would post links but can not guarantee them to be true, so I will not.

While bragging rights are fun, I would not be the 1st owner of an atomic flying hover car. From what I have seen the better hardware is never the 1st off the line. Anyone with a 780i or 790i feels the pain as the FTW editions are released and then the PMW FTW. Some of the Asus "extreme" 775 mobo's have leaking water blocks. I am of course speaking historically not "what is coming".

So far, of the early leaks of mobos specs, the winner looks to be Asus but the board seems to have a big design SNAFU. There are 3 pci x 2.0 slots but 2 of them are in the bottom 2 slots, next to each other and unless you can find a very low profile waterblock, you'll never get 3 dual slot cards on the board.

Some of the bonuses are an integrated raid controller chip (shares cpu useage), and a hand held over clocking controler (noobs are gonna fry there comps) and all the mobos seem to support sli and crossfire, as well as have 6 ram slots. While the idea of having 12 GB of ram is fun I have 8 gigs of ram in my comp now and unless I am benchmarking, I have never seen more than 60% of it used (I was running 3 games a web browser, teamspeak, and a bunch of vista goodies, at the time, just to see if I could do it. So, I am not seeing the benefit of running 12GB.)

My plan: custom build a case from scratch using raw materials and get the water cooling parts mounted. Then grab the universal harware: new harddrives, a massive PSU, fans and controlers and the like. By that time, the people with more money than brains will have bought the I7 gear and tested it for me. Then I will make an informed decision and purchase in the spring.

I do apologize for the wall of text, just trying to share info.

Lord Sojar · Oct 21, 2008, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Voltage won't matter nearly as much, because you have to look at it from a amplitude, not raw power. That is the beauty of a IMC.

In other news:

AMD Deneb clocks to 4.0GHz on air easily. Bai2u Intel. KTHX.

Age · Oct 22, 2008, 12:36 AM // 00:36

What I suggest to the OP is buy one at your local computer store not online and tell them what you are going to use it for.I prefer to buy local as the store is close buy and there is no shipping and handling and they know my system.It is not only that you are supporting your local economy not some chaep online computer shopping centre.You might as well order a Dell or HP online atleast they have local customer support in your area.

You wouldn't buy car online would you.

Lord Sojar · Oct 22, 2008, 04:45 AM // 04:45

Ummm... Newegg is an amazing company and you are suggesting to buy RETAIL? Dear god... not to mention of course you are suggesting a prebuilt system, which is lol.

Building your own system is substantially cheaper, Newegg is the best company on the planet hands down, and Dell is....uh... LOL?

Quaker · Oct 22, 2008, 04:20 PM // 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Ummm... Newegg is an amazing company and you are suggesting to buy RETAIL? Dear god... not to mention of course you are suggesting a prebuilt system, which is lol.

Building your own system is substantially cheaper, Newegg is the best company on the planet hands down, and Dell is....uh... LOL?

Newegg is RETAIL. Just because they are on-line doesn't make them NOT a retailer. (Basically, if you sell to the public, you are retail.)

Given the current state of the computer biz, building your own system is not substantially cheaper than buying pre-built. The main advantage of building your own is that you get exactly what you want. But given the low mark-up on computer parts, and warranty and support considerations, there is no great financial benefit to the average user. Of course, this all depends upon where you buy your stuff and who you compare to.

Age · Oct 22, 2008, 09:38 PM // 21:38

You can still build your own just but the partsin your hometown and keep some people empolyed and feed the local economy.We up here can't use order from newegg and tigerdicrect.ca most of the stuff comes from the states so it wouldn't do us any good

Ordering from Dell a tech will be at your door the next day unlike a week or a few days from newegg.

Feed your local economy as you all in the US need it as you are headed for a recession.

Tarun · Oct 22, 2008, 09:42 PM // 21:42

You can't use newegg? Since when?

http://www.newegg.ca/

Been out for close to a month or so now.

Age · Oct 22, 2008, 09:48 PM // 21:48

It depends on if the parts are shipped within Canada and not trucked up from the US if so we pay extra and gst goods and services tax.

That is what tigerdirect.ca does trucks them up from the US so there will be gst added to the price as well as shipping costs and our dollar is droped.

Lord Sojar · Oct 22, 2008, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

Newegg is RETAIL. Just because they are on-line doesn't make them NOT a retailer. (Basically, if you sell to the public, you are retail.)

Given the current state of the computer biz, building your own system is not substantially cheaper than buying pre-built. The main advantage of building your own is that you get exactly what you want. But given the low mark-up on computer parts, and warranty and support considerations, there is no great financial benefit to the average user. Of course, this all depends upon where you buy your stuff and who you compare to.

E-tailing isn't retail by the classic definition. Retail involves a bit more. Brick and mortar mainly, but in addition, cashiers, direct customer support (face to face), etc. Retail also involves A supplier going to a distribution center to a retail distributor to the retailer. Markups at each point along the way I might add. Newegg can be considered an online retailer by modern definition, but that point can be debated both ways. Suffice to say, if Newegg is to be considered retail, they certainly don't have the markup that most brick and mortar retailers do, no sales tax, and very low shipping rates arranged with FedEx/UPS.

When you buy in a brick and mortar retailer, you pay initial markup, shipping costs for the company, store placement markup, sales tax, and middleman markup. This adds up quickly.

And in this thread, we are dealing with Alexandra. She knows how to build her own PC, she wants to build her own. Why in the world are you recommending or even suggesting premade? Premade computers are great, for those that do not bother with building their own. If you are willing and able to build your own, it is foolish not to. Period.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

It depends on if the parts are shipped within Canada and not trucked up from the US if so we pay extra and gst goods and services tax.

That is what tigerdirect.ca does trucks them up from the US so there will be gst added to the price as well as shipping costs and our dollar is droped.

The CAD's value isn't affected by shipping! LOL!!!!! That is directly affected by your economy. Newegg is outsourcing their shipping to UPS/Fedex, who are INTERNATIONAL shippers. You might pay a few more cents per parcel pound, but beyond that, no difference.

zamial · Oct 22, 2008, 11:43 PM // 23:43

lol this thread is a bit off course but what the heck.

I would never buy computer parts at a retail store. prebuilt is just that, a clone. If you want a clone machine then cool if you want cutting edge or near a prebuilt is so not the way to go.

prebuilt pros and cons:
Everything is assembled by 1 company and supported by that company. That company will use the cheapest parts and cut corners where it can. Some prebuilt system specs are elusive to find(ever try and find exact specs for ram or a mobo from HP?). They may use proprietary parts. If you open the case you have instantaneously voided any warranty in most cases. You have little to no control over system specs or parts short of what it comes with. It has the "look" of every computer exactly like like it.

custom pros and cons:
You need to have a good knowledge of what hardware will work best together. You can control every aspect of the parts ordered. Should a part fail after RMA period you will need to use the warranty for that parts manufacturer. You can have a truly unique looking computer. You need basic computer skills and some patience when assembling.

The economics behind either choice. Most electronic components are made somewhere in Asia.

prebuilt: This money goes to a major corporation that employs many people more than likely the owners are somewhere in asia as well as the factories and that is where your money is going, even if you buy it from a mom and pop store.

custom: With a little research if you really wanted to help your local economy you have a better chance of that going custom. My example is Patriot RAM. while certainly not considered the best ram on micron chips, it is made here in the US.

The argument of getting a prebuilt out of a local store is plain silly, you keep a small store open for a little longer that can not compete in a world market. While with diligent research, it is possible to keep factories open that employee many people......

I for 1 am done with prebuilts FOREVER. I am currently building a comp for my dad. The case is going to be a modified 30mm ammo can (army surplus) I will be using the above Patriot ram in the build as well as any other american parts I can find. My dad does not play games or do much than surf, type documents and E-mail. He is also a veteran and the ammo can theme will match his computer room. This is the advantage to building a custom built, the love. Ask anyone who has custom built a computer they put LOVE and PRIDE into the build.